[cobalt-users] Debating on list (was: Re: PortSentry works !)

[Rodolfo Paiz <rpaiz@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

> I'm lost here.  I see a GREAT thread like Craig Napier's
> IPChains FULL example <BTW thanks Craig- as I had similar
> output and you helped answer a few of the many questions
> I had go NOWHERE, no help, no comments, nothing.

Not a lot of help to offer... I'm still studying it to see how to best
implement it. Besides, Craig was *giving* help not asking for it... not
much to discuss with him.

> I am trying NOT to sound 'pissy'

Not successful. Nice try, though. (Wrote this three times, it *STILL*
sounds sarcastic. Not intentional. Oh, well...)

> it seems as though the more controversy = more threads/activity
> while some of the really important threads, i.e. firewalls,
> goes through quietly.

What you have missed (although in good faith) is that a lot of the good
stuff, i.e. firewalls, takes **WORK**. Frankly, it scares the bejezus
out of me to be 4,000 miles away from my server and fsck something up.
So I'm going to study ipchains until I'm good and comfy. Until then, I
don't have a whole lot to say. So I've got 30 posts on ipchains and
portsentry still marked as "unread" because I want to reread them, study
them, make it work, ***then*** post another article like Craig's trying
to help other people.

Now, stream-of-consciousness lawyer-bashing... *that* I can participate
in quickly and copiously and even have fun doing it. It's something that
gets quick answers, because they are easy answers and all of at least
*think* we're funny. :)

> All this garbage is going to show up in a search for
> Portsentry and another newbie is going to have problems
> searching the archives.

Good point. Changed the subject line partially, if that does anything.

> I don't mind debates, I would just like them to be
> about a helpful topic rather than a simple chat.

They usually are. Even the ones about guns and burglars are how we as a
collective mind educate ourselves on the environment--legal among
others--that surrounds us. Chat yes... but educational chat, since what
you have here (although it may not look it) is a bunch of people who
have (a) lots of experience and/or (b) lots of dedication and interest.
Some are amateurs; but none are fools. Well, except the idgit who keeps
suggesting we sue Cobalt.

However, you again whip right by a small but important point: this is a
*community*, and sometimes you just have to, er, commute. <grin> These
bullshit debates and conversations are where we figure out who
flash22@xxxxxxx is (which otherwise we wouldn't know), what his
experience is, what he knows, what his attitude is, whether we find him
credible, and even what his gender is. This is how we get to know and
trust each other.

Less formal, yes... less concentrated, yes... less focused, yes... but
dammit if the chat stops, I'm outta here. Over time I'm building
friendships here, people whom I'll help for free and who will in turn
help me; because over time and across the bullshit sessions, we have
grown not just to trust each other but to like each other.

You'll get used to it. But one thing I'll give you: other-people-bashing
is a Bad Thing (tm) and should not go on. Again, you should've been here
last year; we've all grown considerably more civilized.

Loosen up a little... but stick to your mindset. Overall it's healthy
and you'll be a good influence on the group.

--
Rodolfo J. Paiz
rpaiz@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:rpaiz@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>