Re: [cobalt-users] Need advice on Colocating or Self Location

[Grant Stern <grantstern@xxxxxxx>]

>> No, living in a 10k sq. ft. co-lo center is not the deal, unless you like
>> things really cold and windowless at home.  However, if you are doing more
>> than hosting, such as print design, photography, commercial printing, tv
>> production, or just have physical product to sell, having a physical space
>> that supports these activities leaves tons of room for a data cabinet or
>> room.  I work with an MRI center owner, just got a T1 in his office (3000
>> storefront space in West Palm Beach), as case in point.  He has a nice cold,
>> dark closet next to the monster sized dino machines that power his equipment
>> (12" floppy anyone) that will hold a raq full of raqs next month.  10k
>> warehouses run 5000 a month to purchase.  I'm working on getting one, ok,
>> let you know how it turns out.
> 
> Are you sure those weren't 8" floppies?  That's the largest I've ever
> seen.  They do look big, though <smile>.

They could have been 8" but I didn't compare the two items, its a classy
place you know, hehe.

> This is what I preach against.  For some of my clients, hosting from
> their own office makes sense, but most of us need more connection
> redundancy and more peak bandwidth than we can afford unless we share
> it.

It took me a while to realize why this is a good exception.  He has been
running a hosting company for some time, in a manner of speaking.  MRIs use
GE (and I think some proprietary form of unix, off the subject tho)
dinosaurs and big magnets.  Where's this going?  He has the same
requirements as a web host.  Heavy building, AC to spare (its 60 degrees in
there all day, freezing cold at night!), category 5 blg, I'm checking on
emergency generator.  Running those 5 ton machines 24 hours and cooling the
magnets, and shielding it and securing it.

> And sharing it puts you into the colo business, out of your core area of
> expertise; the area in which you can make money.

Ok, true, but making the sales and the sites for one, always a good idea.

> And if you offer colo, unless it's just for your friends, you have to
> compete, which means security, redundant power, redundant air
> conditioning, redundant connections, and redundant 24-hour people on
> call.  It gets expensive fast.

Ok, see above.  This really is a special case.  Tour our facilities :)
http://www.openmri4u.com
I made that site :)

>> I agree.  But if you want space, more is better, the small spaces are twice
>> as expensive, and I see potential in purchase more than rental for
>> buildings.
> 
> Purchasing during a recession, even a minor one, is a great idea if you
> can afford it.  But you then have a big building with big tax bills and
> big mortgage payments unless you've paid cash.

I'll pay cash if you have some change to spare.  But I am looking for
investors.  Lol.  Anyone want to fund my .com startup, I'll give you a
business plan after the check cashes. ;)

> 
> So you have to be able to afford it and to ride out the recession.  It's
> hardly a topic for a Cobalt list.

Agreed.


> that kind of core business it's probably pretty local (I have an old
> childhood friend in tv production in Miami, you may know him or know of
> him).

Does your friend live on the business end of the camera, or behind it?

> 
>> My adsl loves downtown, and so do I.
> 
> I use my aDSL for my home connection.  I wouldn't use it for hosting, I
> wouldn't depend on it for anything.  My backup modem has been online for
> hours at a time some days <frown>.

You don't have to tell me about dsl problems.  I used to be on a northpoint
provided system.  It is what it is.  Maybe when my mother asked why I didn't
host sites from my apartment, I mentioned what you said above.

>> No, probably not, but, maybe some of us want to sell raq hosting space for
>> 225 a month like my buddies at unowho.net do.  If you can sell 10 of em to
>> companies (local cpa/attorney maybe?) then a cabinet would be nice.
> 
> If he has to charge $225 a month for 1U, he may be paying too much.
> Either that, or his ancillary overhead may be too high; people tell me
> my 1U fee is too high, and it's significantly less than that.

He's cramped for space at the moment, and they provide the raq.  It is a
first class data center though, lotsa climate control, security, etc.  Much
better than a previous co-lo, where they would unplug their hardware
firewall when they cleaned the server Rack.  We had to call them to remind
them to plug it back in :(

> Open invitation to one of my buddies to list my prices <smile>.

Shoot them to me offlist if you would.  I like to know. . .

>> Granted (pardon the pun), but once you have one raq running, the others are
>> easier to figure out.  And once you have a connection, unless you're
>> planning to host major multinational sites, you can put quite a few boxes
>> online.  I'm studying the benefits of whipping up an office communication
>> ASProvider with my local network and php gods.  As luck would have it, I'm a
>> far better designer than they are, so they want me on the project.
> 
> I still see no reason for a designer to become a colo provider in your
> above response.

Because people pay for it, and because I can.  Nice thing about the raq, I
can make instructions for a tech supporter in no time.  Already have a
training newb for making template driven sites :)  I do train people in web
design, its makes me a better designer when I teach.

>> Ok, so I haven't been in the hosting business that long, but I did sign up
>> for yahoo, using LYNX in 1995.  I started using next machines back then too,
>> back when I was excited to get spammed!
> 
> Hmmmm.... by 1995 I'd been online for almost 20 years.  Does it matter
No, it doesn't matter, but I do pine for LYNX whenever IE crashes.

> <smile>?  Next?  Do you mean those machines designed by that guy who
> started a company with a kid I knew, building computers in their garage?

Yes, that is the one, the black cube, with PostScript display monitor.
Remember what you said about expensive parts help, this baby's got
everything.  It's a T-Rex among dinosaur machines (sorry jeff, its vintage
1988).  I have one and am going to make it a nice dedicated dns box soon.
If you want, I have the full 7.6 os on floppy and cd.  It runs very well on
old i386 machines too.  We put it on a 166 back then and it screamed.  I
prefer os x.  will make a bigger post about that soon, if asked.  Will
switch full time next week when new dsl modem arrives.

>> Who knows?  I didn't because it was overpriced.  This town didn't feel a
>> recession until after 9-11.  I live across the street from the OMNI mall,
>> which they successfully converted into a million sq. ft. colo center
>> essentially.  That is successfully wired the place and had such a high ask
>> price (20k/mo. Rent + depending on build out and that was their smallest
>> offered space), that they were unsuccessful in one small thing!  They did
>> not sign a single lease. . . .
> 
> As I said, colo centers are overbuilt.

This place was made to be a cross between colo center and office building.
Good idea for 1996 bad for 2001

>> Cogent did tell me on the phone today that they charge triple that amount
>> for service providers.  And I wouldn't touch them either.  After hearing
>> about what they do now, and how much build out they plan, I feel sorry for
>> them.  Right idea, little too late.
> 
> The price I mentioned is real and available today.  Perhaps you're
> talking to the wrong Cogent people?
> 
> Or perhaps they've started raising prices and Miami is first?  I don't
> know.

Entirely possible, zone pricing.  Gas stations do it, no reason that
bandwidth providers wouldn't.

> 
>>> pipe dreams?  Again, what in the world are you talking/writing about?
>> 
>> I don't know 'bout you, but I just want a big, fat, data pipe.  Just ordered
>> the OC-48 for my closet at home. Ok, just a dream.
> 
> Oh, that kind of pipe <smile>.  Now I understand <smile, again>.

Not this type of pipe my friend:

http://groups.google.com/groups?q=pipe&hl=en&safe=off&selm=3b7ec3e3.2967468%
40news1.lig.bellsouth.net&rnum=1

Later
grant
-- 
http://heybartender.org
High Impact Design