[cobalt-users] Re: Have I just gone insane about (moving) these Lists?

[Bruce Timberlake <bruce@xxxxxxxxxx>]

> 	#6 - I see constant voting posts for Bruce to take the
> lead on this problem and determine what to do next.  I'm with
> that decision as I think he personally did a damn good job with
> it until his demise with Sun.  So we need to hear from him to
> determine what's next, but again, if it's not this week you
> get to see dead air.

There was a fundamental misunderstanding on my part about what had been 
proposed for "moving the lists."  As far as I was concerned, moving the lists 
meant setting up new lists on another server, and hopefully importing the 
content/archived postings from the Cobalt/Sun list into the new one.  Jeff et 
al. had been considering "forcibly" signing up email addresses, which have 
posted to the Sun lists in the last 3-12 months, onto the new lists.

I think this would not be the right thing to do, although it *would* provide a 
smoother transition for folks who might not realize what's coming (although 
you'd think with the amount of traffic on the lists in the last 10 days that 
they'd realize *something* was happening!). As far as I know, that will *not* 
be happening.

So there are "mirror" lists (cobalt-users, -developers, -security, -announce) 
now set up and hosted by Ryan Verner under the qbalt.com domain. And there is 
the cobaltfacts list, which was started a year or so ago in response to the 
Sun lists' possible demise at that time.  Personally, I'm a member on all of 
them.  And if there are any other lists, we should get that info out as well.

Ultimately I think some consolidation will take place; for now, there's no 
harm in having "too many" lists.  It makes it more likely someone who needs 
help will stumble across one of them.

Nobody has been, or will be, automatically subscribed to the "new" 
cobalt-*@lists.qbalt.com lists - you have to do it yourself.  I am trying to 
find out how, if possible, to add the Sun/Cobalt lists' archives to the qbalt 
archives. That would provide a single resource for searching all mailing list 
content regardless of whether it's from Cobalt days, the Sun era, or the 
current qbalt chapter...  I don't know if it's possible, what the legal 
ramifications would be, etc.

Many others have already grabbed the archives from the Sun list server and 
have made them available to search as they are in their current form on 
list.cobalt.com.  The one at www.depopo.net is the first one I can recall off 
the top of my head...

> 	#8 - Independent 3rd Party portal/website/whatever to
> handle all this.  It's obvious that those trying to do something,
> however genuine and innocent the offers, are being perceived as
> trying to make a buck or create a new advertising platform for
> Cobalt Lists and support.

I think everyone has the right to do this... heck, I even have my own Cobalt 
site.  Everyone has their own niche of expertise. Trying to combine the 
majority, or even a subset, under one common "provider" would be tricky at 
best.

> Just painfully obvious it's got to be a committee with Bruce at the helm or
> something of that nature. 

Maybe a standard FAQ/set of links that every site can mirror (if they wish). 
That way every Cobalt related site can "feature" whatever they want, but 
regardless of which one someone stumbles across in their search for info, 
they can find a common set of links to other sites with info.

> 	In past posts, I've outlined and responded to layouts about
> how to deal with those offering services and other items.  Should
> they be charged to list, etc.  My answer then, as it is now, is
> that a one-stop shop with paid/unpaid listings for premium services
> should be considered as a revenue source to cover the basic expenses
> of producing the 'portal' and housing the lists in general.  Not
> making a profit, but covering the wholesale expenses related to
> having something like this.

I agree that having one mega-portal with PKGs, HOWTOs, forums, mailing list 
archives, etc. would be Cobalt utopia. Heck, *any* community would love to 
have a resource like that I think! But I just don't see how it can be done.  
Part of the open source community's raison d'etre/driving force is the 
recognition that contributors can get for themselves by doing quality work. 
If you lump it all under one umbrella site, the individual's contributions 
can be overlooked I think, which leads to less incentive to contribute. Also, 
many in the Cobalt community do make money off their knowledge, sometimes 
competing for customers in the same arena (security, updates, etc). I'm not 
sure how to balance competing interests like that.

Websites in general are continually striving for new content. Many individuals 
and commercial providers offer mirror space for Cobalt-related content, and 
that's a great thing.  But I think most people who are savvy enough to come 
up with original content on their own also want to put that info up at their 
own domain, not "give" it to someone else... it's an ego thing, for sure. And 
I'm as guilty as the next person - I run my own Cobalt info site, and I'd 
love it if people could get all their info needs met there.  But I also know 
that I don't know everything, and have no problem directing inquiries to 
other sites/individuals.


Curious - are there any "similar" products/communities we can look at which 
have gone through this sort of issue and see what solutions they have? Any 
sort of "blueprint for a successful and harmonious online community"?? :)